darcs: the first haskell tool more popular than Haskell itself?

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darcs: the first haskell tool more popular than Haskell itself?

Isaac Jones-2
Greetings,

Debian has a system called popularity-contest, which is an opt-in
survey of package use.  I was curious to see the ranking of darcs
among Haskell implementations themselves.  The results: Darcs ranks
higher than ghc and hugs.

#<name> is the package name;
#<inst> is the number of people who installed this package;
#<vote> is the number of people who use this package regularly;
#<old> is the number of people who installed, but don't use this package
#      regularly;
#<recent> is the number of people who upgraded this package recently;
#<no-files> is the number of people whose entry didn't contain enough
#           information (atime and ctime were 0).


#rank name                            inst  vote   old recent no-files (maintainer)
138   darcs                            563   159   280   124     0     (Isaac Jones)
(51)  hugs                             304   119   157    28     0     (Isaac Jones)
321   ghc6                             194    81    80    33     0     (Ian Lynagh)

Hugs is listed in a different category, so the ranking is off.

Ian Lynagh pointed me at this nice graph showing the historical
installation of the three packages:

http://people.debian.org/~igloo/popcon-graphs/index.php?packages=ghc6,darcs,hugs&show_installed=on&want_percent=on&want_legend=on&beenhere=1

peace,

  isaac
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Re: darcs: the first haskell tool more popular than Haskell itself?

Iavor Diatchki
(note: these are just some random thoughts to get the day started :-))
hi,
is this really surprising?  compilers (for any language) are only of
interest to developers, while most applications written in the
language have a wide user base, so i would assume that there are many
situations where this holds (internet explorer more popular than
visual c++?).  of course, darcs itself is a tool aimed at developers,
but again, haskell developers are a subset of all the developers that
can use it.  yet another thing (and this is debian specific) is that i
use the darcs distributed with debian, which is old but works fine,
but i don't use the ghc distributed with debian because it is old, and
somewhat broken. still, it is good to know that a tool written in
haskell is doing so well, but this is not surprising either, because
after all, haskell is a pretty cool programming language.
-iavor

On 1/24/06, Isaac Jones <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Greetings,
>
> Debian has a system called popularity-contest, which is an opt-in
> survey of package use.  I was curious to see the ranking of darcs
> among Haskell implementations themselves.  The results: Darcs ranks
> higher than ghc and hugs.
>
> #<name> is the package name;
> #<inst> is the number of people who installed this package;
> #<vote> is the number of people who use this package regularly;
> #<old> is the number of people who installed, but don't use this package
> #      regularly;
> #<recent> is the number of people who upgraded this package recently;
> #<no-files> is the number of people whose entry didn't contain enough
> #           information (atime and ctime were 0).
>
>
> #rank name                            inst  vote   old recent no-files (maintainer)
> 138   darcs                            563   159   280   124     0     (Isaac Jones)
> (51)  hugs                             304   119   157    28     0     (Isaac Jones)
> 321   ghc6                             194    81    80    33     0     (Ian Lynagh)
>
> Hugs is listed in a different category, so the ranking is off.
>
> Ian Lynagh pointed me at this nice graph showing the historical
> installation of the three packages:
>
> http://people.debian.org/~igloo/popcon-graphs/index.php?packages=ghc6,darcs,hugs&show_installed=on&want_percent=on&want_legend=on&beenhere=1
>
> peace,
>
>   isaac
> _______________________________________________
> Haskell-Cafe mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
>
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Re: darcs: the first haskell tool more popular than Haskell itself?

Josh Hoyt
Iavor,

>On 1/24/06, Isaac Jones <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Debian has a system called popularity-contest, which is an opt-in
>> survey of package use.  I was curious to see the ranking of darcs
>> among Haskell implementations themselves.  The results: Darcs ranks
>> higher than ghc and hugs.

On 1/24/06, Iavor Diatchki <[hidden email]> wrote:
> is this really surprising?  compilers (for any language) are only of
> interest to developers, while most applications written in the
> language have a wide user base [...]

To me, it's a sign that Haskell may finally be on the road to wider
acceptance. The fact that there is now an application that is used by
more than just Haskell hackers is cause for surprise and rejoicing for
this Haskell newcomer.

Josh
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Re: darcs: the first haskell tool more popular than Haskell itself?

Jared Updike
JH> To me, it's a sign that Haskell may finally be on the road to wider
JH> acceptance. The fact that there is now an application that is used by
JH> more than just Haskell hackers is cause for surprise and rejoicing for
JH> this Haskell newcomer.

What happened to "Avoid success at all costs?" [1]

  Jared.

[1] seventh slide, Simon Peyton Jones,
http://research.microsoft.com/Users/simonpj/papers/haskell-retrospective/

--
http://www.updike.org/~jared/
reverse ")-:"
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Re: darcs: the first haskell tool more popular than Haskell itself?

Josh Hoyt
On 1/24/06, Jared Updike <[hidden email]> wrote:
> What happened to "Avoid success at all costs?" [1]
>
>   Jared.
>
> [1] seventh slide, Simon Peyton Jones,
> http://research.microsoft.com/Users/simonpj/papers/haskell-retrospective/

I was unaware of that motto. It looks like we'd better do something to
make darcs harder to use.

Josh
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Re: darcs: the first haskell tool more popular than Haskell itself?

Isaac Jones-2
In reply to this post by Iavor Diatchki
Iavor Diatchki <[hidden email]> writes:

(snip)
> yet another thing (and this is debian specific) is that i
> use the darcs distributed with debian, which is old but works fine,

The darcs shipped w/ Debian "Stable" might be oldish, but that's the
darcs that was available when Debian was frozen.  The Debian unstable
version is 1.0.5 (the newest), and testing should be there soon.

If you're using stable, you can configure your system so that you can
say:
apt-get install darcs/unstable

So it'll just get the unstable darcs and keep everything else as
stable.

peace,

  isaac
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Re: darcs: the first haskell tool more popular than?Haskell itself?

Chung-chieh Shan-2
In reply to this post by Josh Hoyt
Josh Hoyt <[hidden email]> wrote in article <[hidden email]> in gmane.comp.lang.haskell.cafe:
> On 1/24/06, Jared Updike <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > What happened to "Avoid success at all costs?"
> > http://research.microsoft.com/Users/simonpj/papers/haskell-retrospective/
> I was unaware of that motto. It looks like we'd better do something to
> make darcs harder to use.

Time for a coalgebra of patches?

--
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Ooh, that's a pane in the neck.

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